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Alex Rollins Berg's avatar

Great post. I worry often about the weaponization of empathy, and I agree that focusing on what we can improve locally, especially in our relationships, is the wisest approach. As Voltaire put it, we must "cultivate our garden."

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Sean Byrnes's avatar

The fact that folks might abuse empathy isn't a reason to temper it. If we avoided doing things because certain people would seek to exploit them, we would never do anything at all! Instead, empathy is something we enjoy regardless of the downside. Yes, people abused the PPP program but that doesn't mean we should avoid programs like that in the future.

I also reject the idea that empathy requires reciprocity. The LGBTQ community is free to support the Palestinian cause even if the Palestinians don't have empathy for the LGBTQ community. Most religions teach us to have empathy for others regardless of how others feel about us for a reason. Empathy is not a transactional barter. Empathy is a choice.

I do agree with you that some political movements have tried to use empathy as a loyalty test or tool of isolation, but I'm not sure how successful they have been. If anything, empathy seems to be chipping away at the MAGA movement as people realize that cruelty is not something worth standing for...

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Adam Singer's avatar

I appreciate the thoughts as always Sean. And I think having empathy for people who hate you silently is one thing, as you might all human beings that exist, but spending time to promote/endorse them? Feels like their emotions have been weaponized against them. I don't know how else to interpret that one.

Also re: the loans thing, perhaps better parameters could solve these things. With empathy here should come lots of accountability up front. Our tolerance for fraud here is clearly just not high enough.

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David Collado's avatar

"Palestine" doesn't hate queers. Hamas does. I personally know several queer Palestinians. Queers can totally support the Palestinian cause for freedom from an apartheid state without supporting Hamas's brutal backwardness. Those ideas are not mutually exclusive. I know because I'm able to hold them both in my mind at the same time with no problem. You should try it.

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Adam Singer's avatar

Yes as I said in the post we want to free Palestine from Hamas! If that's what they are actually protesting for, they have moral clarity here

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Sean Byrnes's avatar

re: loans, I don't think it's possible to create such huge programs and not have a significant amount of fraud. There are too many people interested in taking the easy path by doing fraud instead of working hard, and it's not cost effective to try and create air tight programs.

Government programs will always be subject to fraud, and it scales with the size of the program. It's not just the US, it happens everywhere.

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Adam Singer's avatar

I did hear they are actively prosecuting many of the fraudsters so perhaps those stories will serve as cautionary tale for people. It's really not worth it to have the gov pursuing you for stuff like that or tax fraud. Living with that anxiety is def its own punishment even if they don't catch you.

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Sean Byrnes's avatar

Maybe they understand what it's like to be persecuted? I don't think we need to map our own belief systems onto theirs, just respect their agency to feel empathy.

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Stowe Boyd's avatar

Perhaps compassion is enough. We don't have to actively mirror someone's emotional state or feel their pain to help them. And, as you point out, it can be a trap.

As I wrote in February, https://www.workfutures.io/i/157312103/seasonality-finding-meaning-and-purpose, 'Our compassion is the reflection of our involvement in community, and our efforts to apply what we know to improve the world, at any scale'.

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Paper Street Capital's avatar

Such a banger, I was thinking about this exact concept on my drive home last night. What does it look like when the empathetic checks start to bounce? I'm certainly at my end as I've grown to see how easily a good culture (neighborhood, school, etc.) can get completely corrupted by very few malicious exploitative actors. Even the smallest decisions matter to keep the world from falling apart.

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David Collado's avatar

"...just as true empathy for an addict means helping them get sober, not enabling their addiction."

Do you honestly think San Francisco only enables addiction and does nothing else to help addicts?!

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